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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2006 9:51 am 
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I usually play Homeworld multiplayer with max AI players, all set to attack me. This is a challenge, particularly when the AIs sometimes seem to get a clue and decide to attack together in force simultaneously. Anyway, playing this way has made me notice some oddities in behaviour.

Example 1:
On fixed resources maps, once all the resources have all been harvested, all the AI players' resource collectors/controllers return to military parade formation. There they remain until I arrive - usually salvaging them whilst destroying any defence force :) Now it would be better for the AI player, once resources are exhausted, to retire these ships. They have no value any more and they may provide enough resources to finish that heavy cruiser it wanted. Certainly, it should deny me the possibility of converting them into resources for my fleet.

Example 2:
You cannot retire a research ship. Once you've researched everything it is of no more use and represents a sizeable number of resources (6-module research ship = 4200; heavy cruiser = 3700). A potential argument against enabling retirement might be that you should have the research ship if you wish to use any of the technical advances it has made. However, when my research ship is destroyed I still have the full (researched) construction roster available, so the lack of retirement possibility seems strange.

So here's my question:

Is upgrading the AI (1) or adding abilities for consistency (2) considered to be changing the gameplay mechanics of the original game (in which case the player should have the opportunity to toggle the behaviour) or are they "bug fixes" in that the original behaviour is not something that a player would reasonably expect?

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2006 7:17 pm 
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I'd be for the changes, as long as it is tested well (particularly the AI mods).

so are they bug fixes? Maybe, but more to the point, its enticing to me, I'd roll with it.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2006 8:31 pm 
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I'd say it is a bug fix.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 5:45 am 
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lmop wrote:
Example 1:
On fixed resources maps... all the AI players' resource collectors/controllers return to military parade formation.

Example 2:
You cannot retire a research ship.
....

Is upgrading the AI (1) or adding abilities for consistency (2) considered to be changing the gameplay mechanics of the original game (in which case the player should have the opportunity to toggle the behaviour) or are they "bug fixes" in that the original behaviour is not something that a player would reasonably expect?


Neither of these are bugs, although both are irritating.

The resourcer will sometimes, depending on conditions, go to the defense formation of the last ship it docked with and offer itself up as cannon fodder for attacking ships while remaining available for future use... i.e. not cashing itself in without explicit permission.

You will have noted that the behavior is not limited to maps with static resources.

("...Where did my other resourcer go? Oh frack.... I told it to dock. Yep. There it is, hanging out with the fighters by the carrier... Back to work, you!...")

Besides which, the awesome fighting power of a resourcer and its PDA beam is very underrated I think. They're stone-cold killers if you get a dozen of them working on a gravwelled scout.

(Thus says the zapkitty... who once in his youth, like all skirmish-vs-cpu players, salvaged a Taidan mothership to death.)

The labs are meant to be resources spent and not recoverable precisely because that would enable major cannabilization with no real penalty late in a game.

It would be nice to save these for the toggled items, I think.

But if asking about changes to gameplay options be sure to copy the query to the relic forums...

http://forums.relicnews.com/forumdisplay.php?f=16

...far more feedback there than this relatively specialized forum.

As for me... now the linux install has me looking at rgl in an unfriendly fashion... anyone note a trend...?

relevant to this forum: At the least devstats is up for revamp. With a current OS it should simply query about which graphics functions are available and stop worrying about the peculiar specifications of decade-old graphics cards.

Barring someone pointing out an error on my part that's what I will be doing next, and a coherent linux install should follow shortly after.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 1:09 pm 
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He isn't talking about having them automatically retire for players, but the CPU in the computer skirmishes.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 11:47 am 
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Merturk_NB wrote:
He isn't talking about having them automatically retire for players, but the CPU in the computer skirmishes.


If so then that would be a sensible thing.

I was just pointing out that the code involved more than AI players and had effects elsewhere as well.

But I can see no way past the lab recycling without changing play balance.


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